I wish I'd known that before...

[Dave]

For my part I wish Iā€™d known....

What constitutes a WP duel! (I think we played it right, lesson; donā€™t rely on forums for rules).
That Toni has Staggered built in to her punch attack.
That Toni has a 6ā€ pulse to give adversary to everyone in range (that would have been very useful).

It was a great game though, finishing 6-6.

Finally, donā€™t read rules for games the week before playing a different game (the Pass token thing was a rule from Elder Scrolls).

[Brad85]

Nice write up.

Thatā€™s tough going on losing both snipers turn 2, what did he have that was capable of doing that much damage? (Appreciating that it was at least two of his models that did it).

A lot of Goryo's and Ikiryo's were involved, plus my attacks on them caused me damage. So between the choice of be stuck in engagement and eventually die, i kind of took the go down swinging choice, just in case some good card flips came my way - not both jokers together

Glad the summoning worked out for you, Minako is solid.

What were the crews composed of?

I took
Misaki
Shang
Yamaziko
Minako
1 Torakage
Shadow Effigy
Samurai
2 Snipers
2 stone pool

The snipers were almost traded for Crime Bosses with a view to chasing Death Beds, which given the amount of carnage in the middle of the board might have been a more solid choice. The plan was kind of 'automate' the schemes, position the models and let what happens happen, while focusing on how the lode stone is moving.
Another option was to keep one Sniper and choose Vendetta...
Still a solid performance and good game from both crews.

[Dave]

Sounds like you did well and if not for a few (un)timely lures you would have scored another point or two.

Whatā€™s your key takeaways from facing Kirai, what would have helped in beating her, is she worth going after and trying to kill?

[Brad85]

I never got near her, Simon did a good job of keeping at the back pushing, supporting and summoning other models. I think if I plan to get stuck in with combat I need models that can take more damage to get over the vengeance damage, but ultimately it's just speed and timing. I could outrun and move around the board, but the extra models on the table meant he didn't have to be mobile and would have an activation or two left after me - even using the pass tokens to hold off movement.

To be honest, trying to push through to get at her would basically be suicide and waste of a few model's turns. In my keyword the guys with the clout don't have the speed and the ones with the speed don't have the clout - funny that. There's probably a balance to do it, but it would distract from the objectives.

[DaVinci's Cat]

What were the crews composed of?

I took the following:

Kirai (+The Whisper)
Irikyo
Datsue Ba
Jaakuna Ubume
Goryo (+Grave Spirits Touch)
Lost Love
Onryo
2x Seishin
7 SS

Out of pool of schemes, I elected to go with Spread Them Out and Vendetta. As mentioned previously, the majority of the schemes werenā€™t ideal for Kirai (need another Master then) so had to work around what was there. Kirai isnā€™t the most efficient at dropping markers, she and her crew actually need to spend APs to drop rather than drop them off triggers etc.

The game was really hard fought, very tactical and with the lead changing a couple of times. As Brad mentioned, it was tied heading into Turn 5. In fact, it was tied at 5-5 up until the last couple of activations ā€“ the push of the effigy (got lucky with the Daze Trigger) to deny Bradā€™s Research Mission and then to move Jaakuna to get a scheme marker down for Spread Them Out. Effectively gave a 2 point swing in my favour. I ended up with 3 for Strategies and 3 for Schemes (2 Vendetta, 1 Spread Them Out).

I thought I was done for on turn 2 when the Torakage disappeared across the other side of the board from my Onryo, but he kindly came back into the centre of the board Turn 3 /4 to allow me to get the first half of Vendetta before swiftly dying to allow in to keep the Onryo free to survive for the second part.

A completely different crew to go against this time around ā€“ Minako is strong ā€“ itā€™s really interesting figuring out how to deal with her as the Karmic Fate/Debt mechanism leads to either attempting to sacrifice 1 model and take her down in an alpha strike (easier said than done as a Henchman) or just avoid her and look to slow her down with conditions or ping damage. I think sheā€™s better than Ototo, mainly due to higher Df and Wp. Ototoā€™s 4 for both does make him a bit of a target.

Yamaziko is a really good buff machine ā€“ worked really well with Samurai which is a scary piece in its own right. It does need to be dealt with but if you punch it had enough with a sharp stick, it does fall. In this case, projectile vomiting over it worked a treat, especially as part of the crew was bubbled up at that point.
I think that the snipers were positioned too aggressively for shooters (possibly fell into the Deploy from Shadows trap). They were fairly easy early pickings ā€“ I think I only had to suffer one shot from each before I managed to engage in Melee. It will be interesting to see how it works by swapping out one for a Crime Boss and playing the remaining one as a long range nuisance.

Finally, donā€™t read rules for games the week before playing a different game (the Pass token thing was a rule from Elder Scrolls

Agree with this ā€“ Iā€™d clearly been reading other cards/crews earlier in the week hence the discard/heal faux-pas. That said, it only happened once before we corrected.

In the end, the summons ambiguity didnā€™t really matter as the Lodestone was always transferred or carrying by the original starting crew (as in the game with Tom in the end) but would welcome peopleā€™s thoughts/interpretations on Section 4: Encounters, Para 2 in the April 2021 FAQ. As discussed, it only really impacts Corrupted Ley Lines the other 3 Strategies require an interaction which is a no-no.

I ended up making quite a few mistakes throughout, caused by Bradā€™s positioning of some very effective characters. Whilst Kirai was kept very safe behind a building and got busy with summoning, Iā€™m sure she could be used more effectively (just need to figure out how) but she was throwing suitable chaff out a the opponent to slow any advance towards her. Some of the best ā€˜chaffā€™ are The Drowned, it was good to get Projectile Vomit off a couple of time and theyā€™re fairly resilient pieces. Iā€™m looking to enhance their use a little more by considering hiring Anna Lovelace as another Henchman. This will also help hinder the opponent placing models with the Gravity Well Ability.

Regarding Henchmen, I didnā€™t use Datsue Ba very well. I ended up getting stuck behind the building with Kirai very cognisant of the damage that the Samurai and Minako could put out and this meant that once the Urami were out of her 8ā€ range, I could no longer get them to walk or charge. I certainly need to use her more aggressively.

Jaakunaā€™s Lures were indeed very useful, and probably the main reason I took her for this one. The ability to move the Shadow Effigy away from a marker just before the end of the turn was useful in terms of dragging him back onto the Strat Point Curve rather than ahead of it where he currently was! It also meant he had to use Misaki as a back up plan to score in a following turn.

Iā€™m still not sold on Lost Love. I know people go on about his healing and marker removal on tomes trigger but I just find him slow and a little underwhelming. Seriously considering leaving him out and getting a 2nd Onryo or ditch both the Onryo and Lost Love for a 2nd Goryo with GST.

I think I should also have tried coming back to the centre for the last Strat point than across the back of the board. I wasn't thinking clearly enough at that stage but thatā€™s no small part to Brad limiting my options and putting quite a bit of stuff where I didnā€™t want it. Again, well played to deny options - if you can't score points, might as well make sure your opponent can't either

Overall, a really enjoyable and challenging game. I still need to know my cards better....

[DaVinci's Cat]

I'd also be interested in Tom's takeaways about how to deal with Toni having gone up against her twice now - anything he'd do differently or any hidden weaknesses?

[Tom]

FAQ section 4 question 2:

Ignored by Strategies and Schemes ā€“ If a model would become ā€œignored by Schemes and Strategiesā€ such as by the effects of Dr. Grimwellā€™s Restraints Ability, is it considered killed by those Strategies and Schemes?*
a) No. It is simply ignored. If it had a Strategy Token (such as a Lodestone Token), that token simply stays on them but has no
effect. As normal, these ā€œignoredā€ models cannot resolve effects of Strategies and Schemes such as Dropping Strategy Markers. However, other models still treat the model as having such a Token and can affect the token as normal, such as Interacting near an ā€œignoredā€ model with a Lodestone Token to move the token off of them.

Which isnā€™t mad helpful as itā€™s mainly talking about gaining being ignored for S&S rather than starting with it.

I read being ignored for strats and schemes to mean they just canā€™t get the lodestone on their summon turn. Any ability that could pass them the token is ignoring them.

[Tom]

I'd also be interested in Tom's takeaways about how to deal with Toni having gone up against her twice now - anything he'd do differently or any hidden weaknesses?

Shoot her or avoid her! Attempting to melee her in any way is going to end badly.

[Tom]

My main takeaway is that the all distraction crew really needs at least some damage output or they just get whittled down. I either need to get better at comboing Investigators/Alan to get that staggered bonus damage, or stop considering them damage dealers. I kept having no plan for where to shuttle Luciusā€™ commands to and thatā€™s not good.

[Dave]

Are you getting much use out of The Whisper on Kirai? Is it all about just trying to make sure you get a decent flip for the summon?

Shoot her or avoid her! Attempting to melee her in any way is going to end badly.

I think you did did well against her this time, I donā€™t recall her killing anything. Combination of me not being able to take my free actions (meaning I lose my ability to take a 4th AP) and making her slow meant she was frustrated most of the game. Iā€™d be taking Alan every game!

Re the need for a beater I donā€™t think Guild really have a Versatile one (Peach Keeper perhaps) or I suppose you could pay the out of keyword tax for something like a Thrall. Thereā€™s agent 46 but Iā€™ve not been overly impressed by him.